[whispersystems] Apple emoji on Android

[James Budarz]

I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent
change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.

In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to ensure
consistency across devices.

Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this change
and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have made their
opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues section (which
makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to any users who
like them.

I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a
design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

[#359]

before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back would only activate their anger again.

and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their war crimes.

if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent
change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to ensure
consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this change
and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have made their
opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues section (which
makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to any users who
like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a
design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor
Android-native.

- 359

[James Budarz]

Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like iOS?
The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on their
phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's been a
huge backlash to this change.

If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent
change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this change
and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have made their
opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues section (which
makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to any users who
like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a
design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[Shankar Kulumani]

I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over these
emojis

These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)

I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like iOS?
The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on their
phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's been a
huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent
change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a
design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[James Budarz]

User adoption is driven by user experience, and donation is driven by user
adoption. It's not a primary issue, no, but it's an issue nonetheless.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over these
emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent
change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a
design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[Shankar Kulumani]

You could try setting up a free poll or something and send it out to the
email list? It might shed some data on who wants the change and those who
don't feel it's important and perhaps some of the reasons for these
feelings.

I've set up a form TextSecure Emoji Poll
<https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1luD8WUCDw6Y9agZeIhRXPY5axmm26cGanxfRddt82YE/edit?usp=sharing>.
Hopefully anyone with the link should be able to edit it.

Feel free to add any questions you see fit and maybe in a few days we can
share it and see what kind of data is returned.

Post by James Budarz
User adoption is driven by user experience, and donation is driven by user
adoption. It's not a primary issue, no, but it's an issue nonetheless.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over
these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into
a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[Matt Langreder]

It's really not that difficult of a problem. iOS users expect an iOS
experience and Android users expect and Android experience. To make an
Android experience match an iOS experience or an iOS experience match an
Android experience goes against this basic expectation of experience. This
has been a battle Android devs including myself have been fighting since
Android came on the scene. Unless the issue is somehow technical in nature,
it's pretty straightforward what the experience should be.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
You could try setting up a free poll or something and send it out to the
email list? It might shed some data on who wants the change and those who
don't feel it's important and perhaps some of the reasons for these
feelings.
I've set up a form TextSecure Emoji Poll
<https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1luD8WUCDw6Y9agZeIhRXPY5axmm26cGanxfRddt82YE/edit?usp=sharing>.
Hopefully anyone with the link should be able to edit it.
Feel free to add any questions you see fit and maybe in a few days we can
share it and see what kind of data is returned.

Post by James Budarz
User adoption is driven by user experience, and donation is driven by
user adoption. It's not a primary issue, no, but it's an issue nonetheless.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over
these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into
a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[James Budarz]

Shankar,
Thank you for putting this together.
I've made some edits to the questionnaire on my own. How do you plan to
distribute it so that we can reach the largest possible audience?

Post by Shankar Kulumani
You could try setting up a free poll or something and send it out to the
email list? It might shed some data on who wants the change and those who
don't feel it's important and perhaps some of the reasons for these
feelings.
I've set up a form TextSecure Emoji Poll
<https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1luD8WUCDw6Y9agZeIhRXPY5axmm26cGanxfRddt82YE/edit?usp=sharing>.
Hopefully anyone with the link should be able to edit it.
Feel free to add any questions you see fit and maybe in a few days we can
share it and see what kind of data is returned.

Post by James Budarz
User adoption is driven by user experience, and donation is driven by
user adoption. It's not a primary issue, no, but it's an issue nonetheless.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over
these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into
a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[Shankar Kulumani]

No problem. I just started the form.

I believe we can send a link that anyone can contribute to.

We could use this mailing list, the Google + page, maybe a link on the
whispersystems website if desired/possible.

Post by James Budarz
Shankar,
Thank you for putting this together.
I've made some edits to the questionnaire on my own. How do you plan to
distribute it so that we can reach the largest possible audience?

Post by Shankar Kulumani
You could try setting up a free poll or something and send it out to the
email list? It might shed some data on who wants the change and those who
don't feel it's important and perhaps some of the reasons for these
feelings.
I've set up a form TextSecure Emoji Poll
<https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1luD8WUCDw6Y9agZeIhRXPY5axmm26cGanxfRddt82YE/edit?usp=sharing>.
Hopefully anyone with the link should be able to edit it.
Feel free to add any questions you see fit and maybe in a few days we can
share it and see what kind of data is returned.

Post by James Budarz
User adoption is driven by user experience, and donation is driven by
user adoption. It's not a primary issue, no, but it's an issue nonetheless.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over
these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a
near continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important
issue is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is
using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that
you don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users
into a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying.
Is there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

[Corvin Russell]

I fully agree with the below. I am sure there are good reasons why this
change was made, but even if there weren't, it is far below other
priorities for TextSecure.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over these
emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent
change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a
design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

--
Twitter: @corvinr <https://twitter.com/corvinr>
Google Plus: https://plus.google.com/115459943980453987525
My PGP key is here
<http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x48CBE0180B9915EF>.

Help restore privacy and freedom of association for everyone by using Signal
<https://itunes.apple.com/app/id874139669> on iPhone and TextSecure
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.securesms&hl=en>
and RedPhone
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.redphone&hl=en>
on
Android.

[Kendra Albert]

I also just joined this mailing list to express my distaste for the change
to Apple emoji. Folks who are complaining about how this is unimportant or
a CIA plot (really?), you might consider how many folks have been willing
to spend their time and energy trying to express their discomfort with this
change compared to other changes and what that means about community
engagement. People care a lot about having a texting program that allows
them to communicate what they want, and sometimes what they want is Android
emojis.

Presumably someone had to actually switch the app to using Apple emoji from
Android, so someone thought this was important in the first place. I know
options come with costs, but I agree with others that a toggle would be
preferable. The current state creates weird inconsistencies with the
experience (I still see Android emoji in my notifications, and my Swiftkey
keyboard still shows them until they show up in the TextSecure window).
Additionally, the Apple emoji that are being used seem to not have all the
same options as iOS (I can't seem to make the "couple with heart" the same
gender in TextSecure, which could lead to some odd miscommunications), and
I prefer the design on the Android emoji. As someone who has been using the
app faithfully, this isn't a deal-breaker for me, but it does make really
really sad.

Anyway, thank you for a great product.

---
Kendra Albert

Post by Corvin Russell
I fully agree with the below. I am sure there are good reasons why this
change was made, but even if there weren't, it is far below other
priorities for TextSecure.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over
these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into
a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

--
Google Plus: https://plus.google.com/115459943980453987525
My PGP key is here
<http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x48CBE0180B9915EF>.
Help restore privacy and freedom of association for everyone by using
Signal <https://itunes.apple.com/app/id874139669> on iPhone and TextSecure
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.securesms&hl=en>
and RedPhone
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.redphone&hl=en> on
Android.

[Jelle Dionot]

Hi Kendra and everyone,

Thanks for taking the time to write this. I second 100% what you have said.

A survey has been made (thank you for that) and opened to the users, don't
forget to participate.

Lastly, thanks all developers and contributors of TextSecure and Open
Whisper Systems for their superb products.

Post by Kendra Albert
I also just joined this mailing list to express my distaste for the change
to Apple emoji. Folks who are complaining about how this is unimportant or
a CIA plot (really?), you might consider how many folks have been willing
to spend their time and energy trying to express their discomfort with this
change compared to other changes and what that means about community
engagement. People care a lot about having a texting program that allows
them to communicate what they want, and sometimes what they want is Android
emojis.
Presumably someone had to actually switch the app to using Apple emoji
from Android, so someone thought this was important in the first place. I
know options come with costs, but I agree with others that a toggle would
be preferable. The current state creates weird inconsistencies with the
experience (I still see Android emoji in my notifications, and my Swiftkey
keyboard still shows them until they show up in the TextSecure window).
Additionally, the Apple emoji that are being used seem to not have all the
same options as iOS (I can't seem to make the "couple with heart" the same
gender in TextSecure, which could lead to some odd miscommunications), and
I prefer the design on the Android emoji. As someone who has been using the
app faithfully, this isn't a deal-breaker for me, but it does make really
really sad.
Anyway, thank you for a great product.
---
Kendra Albert

Post by Corvin Russell
I fully agree with the below. I am sure there are good reasons why this
change was made, but even if there weren't, it is far below other
priorities for TextSecure.

Post by Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over
these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near
continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue
is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you
don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into
a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is
there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

--
Google Plus: https://plus.google.com/115459943980453987525
My PGP key is here
<http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x48CBE0180B9915EF>.
Help restore privacy and freedom of association for everyone by using
Signal <https://itunes.apple.com/app/id874139669> on iPhone and TextSecure
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.securesms&hl=en>
and RedPhone
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.redphone&hl=en> on
Android.

[johanw]

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like iOS?

Because it's open. On Android, you can revert the emoji changes in the
source, rebuild yourself and install the changed app outside any store,
unlike iOS that does not allow sideloading. I do it too because I don't
like some things. If you root and install Lucky Patcher you are even not
biothered with changing signatures.

I was not pleased when the encrypted sms option was removed because that
is NOT easy to put back in and was core functionality, but this is not.

Besides, the Apple emoji look way better.

[Red_Shift]

Hi everyone,

I joined this mailing list because of the emoji change. I think
TextSecure should use the Android emoji set and that the iOS set looks
really ugly in comparison. At the very least could there be a toggle?

Post by johanw

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like iOS?

Because it's open. On Android, you can revert the emoji changes in the
source, rebuild yourself and install the changed app outside any
store, unlike iOS that does not allow sideloading. I do it too because
I don't like some things. If you root and install Lucky Patcher you
are even not biothered with changing signatures.
I was not pleased when the encrypted sms option was removed because
that is NOT easy to put back in and was core functionality, but this
is not.
Besides, the Apple emoji look way better.

[James Budarz]

Here's a survey so we can gauge user reaction to the emoji set.
http://goo.gl/forms/F1CcH8DMm3

It's been posted on the TextSecure Support page and the TextSecure for
Android Beta page.

Thanks for taking the time to fill it out.

[Max Kellermeier]

Hey everyone,


I’m following the mail list for a long time but never contributed to it. But at this point I wanted to mention my opinion.

James was talking about user adoption driven by user experience. Yes, I fully agree, but as the new emoji set is mainly the same as on Whatsapp (from which I consider most people switch to TextSecure. maybe just in my social environment), they don’t have a real change in the emoji usage from now on. Before the update, a lot of people were complaining about the different emoji set. Furthermore, WA also shows the Android emojis in the notifications, as Kendra mentioned. So again, no change when switching to TS.


Anyway, I will stay at TextSecure whatever emoji set is chosen. I wanted to say thank you to the developers for the decision they made as it will be easier for me to convince people of TextSecure. But, what it more important, thank you for such a great app and the always ongoing development!!








Von: Jelle Dionot
Gesendet: ‎Dienstag‎, ‎21‎. ‎Juli‎ ‎2015 ‎17‎:‎11
An: Kendra Albert, Corvin Russell
Cc: Shankar Kulumani, James Budarz, #359, ***@lists.riseup.net





Hi Kendra and everyone,

Thanks for taking the time to write this. I second 100% what you have said.

A survey has been made (thank you for that) and opened to the users, don't forget to participate.

Lastly, thanks all developers and contributors of TextSecure and Open Whisper Systems for their superb products.



Le mar. 21 juil. 2015 17:06, Kendra Albert <***@gmail.com> a écrit :



I also just joined this mailing list to express my distaste for the change to Apple emoji. Folks who are complaining about how this is unimportant or a CIA plot (really?), you might consider how many folks have been willing to spend their time and energy trying to express their discomfort with this change compared to other changes and what that means about community engagement. People care a lot about having a texting program that allows them to communicate what they want, and sometimes what they want is Android emojis.



Presumably someone had to actually switch the app to using Apple emoji from Android, so someone thought this was important in the first place. I know options come with costs, but I agree with others that a toggle would be preferable. The current state creates weird inconsistencies with the experience (I still see Android emoji in my notifications, and my Swiftkey keyboard still shows them until they show up in the TextSecure window). Additionally, the Apple emoji that are being used seem to not have all the same options as iOS (I can't seem to make the "couple with heart" the same gender in TextSecure, which could lead to some odd miscommunications), and I prefer the design on the Android emoji. As someone who has been using the app faithfully, this isn't a deal-breaker for me, but it does make really really sad.




Anyway, thank you for a great product.











---
Kendra Albert
I tweet things: @KendraSerra.








On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 7:36 AM, Corvin Russell <***@gmail.com> wrote:


I fully agree with the below. I am sure there are good reasons why this change was made, but even if there weren't, it is far below other priorities for TextSecure.



2015-07-20 21:58 GMT-04:00 Shankar Kulumani <***@gmail.com>:


I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over these emojis



These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)




I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a near continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important issue is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is using.





On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 7:53 PM James Budarz <***@gmail.com> wrote:




Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's been a huge backlash to this change.


If your best answer against changing it to something better is that you don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to say. I'm just facepalming.



On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 9:33 PM #359 <***@osmocudo.net> wrote:



before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back would only activate their anger again.

and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their war crimes.

if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.









On July 21, 2015 2:28:09 AM CEST, James Budarz <***@gmail.com> wrote:



I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.


In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to ensure consistency across devices.


Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to any users who like them.



I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users into a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying. Is there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.




- 359






--


Twitter: @corvinr
Google Plus: https://plus.google.com/115459943980453987525

My PGP key is here.




Help restore privacy and freedom of association for everyone by using Signal on iPhone and TextSecure and RedPhone on Android.

[Omar B]

So...
1) people on Android don't want apple's emojis
2) people on iOS don't want google's emojis
3) there are some emojis that are not translated quite well between apple
and google emojis
so..
4) we need a consistent experience, maybe with something neutral like emoji
one? If one likes apple emojis they will probably like emoji one too (and
will probably like them WAY better). Android users who complain about
apple's emojis will stop complaining, and Android users who complain about
google's emojis will stop complaining. The emojis will look a bit nicer
than they actually do, and I think it would be a reasonable compromise to
keep a consistent experience on different platforms.

Post by Max Kellermeier
Hey everyone,
I’m following the mail list for a long time but never contributed to it.
But at this point I wanted to mention my opinion.
James was talking about user adoption driven by user experience. Yes, I
fully agree, but as the new emoji set is mainly the same as on Whatsapp
(from which I consider most people switch to TextSecure. maybe just in my
social environment), they don’t have a real change in the emoji usage from
now on. Before the update, a lot of people were complaining about the
different emoji set. Furthermore, WA also shows the Android emojis in the
notifications, as Kendra mentioned. So again, no change when switching to
TS.
Anyway, I will stay at TextSecure whatever emoji set is chosen. I wanted
to say thank you to the developers for the decision they made as it will be
easier for me to convince people of TextSecure. But, what it more
important, thank you for such a great app and the always ongoing
development!!
*Gesendet:* ‎Dienstag‎, ‎21‎. ‎Juli‎ ‎2015 ‎17‎:‎11
Hi Kendra and everyone,
Thanks for taking the time to write this. I second 100% what you have said.
A survey has been made (thank you for that) and opened to the users, don't
forget to participate.
Lastly, thanks all developers and contributors of TextSecure and Open
Whisper Systems for their superb products.

Post by Kendra Albert
I also just joined this mailing list to express my distaste for the
change to Apple emoji. Folks who are complaining about how this is
unimportant or a CIA plot (really?), you might consider how many folks have
been willing to spend their time and energy trying to express their
discomfort with this change compared to other changes and what that means
about community engagement. People care a lot about having a texting
program that allows them to communicate what they want, and sometimes what
they want is Android emojis.
Presumably someone had to actually switch the app to using Apple emoji
from Android, so someone thought this was important in the first place. I
know options come with costs, but I agree with others that a toggle would
be preferable. The current state creates weird inconsistencies with the
experience (I still see Android emoji in my notifications, and my Swiftkey
keyboard still shows them until they show up in the TextSecure window).
Additionally, the Apple emoji that are being used seem to not have all the
same options as iOS (I can't seem to make the "couple with heart" the same
gender in TextSecure, which could lead to some odd miscommunications), and
I prefer the design on the Android emoji. As someone who has been using the
app faithfully, this isn't a deal-breaker for me, but it does make really
really sad.
Anyway, thank you for a great product.
---
Kendra Albert

Post by Corvin Russell
I fully agree with the below. I am sure there are good reasons why this
change was made, but even if there weren't, it is far below other
priorities for TextSecure.

Post by Max Kellermeier
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is occurring over these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources that are better
spent on more important issues. I understand the reasons for TextSecure to
support them (everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on TextSecure on a
near continual basis but the emoji issue is not important. The important
issue is to make a private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is
using.

Post by James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it doesn't look like
iOS? The majority of Android users prefer to have a consistent theme on
their phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design and why there's
been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something better is that
you don't want to irritate the conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to
say. I'm just facepalming.

Post by #359
before the change to apple emojis there were equal people on github
ranting against the android emojis in favour of apple's. so the change back
would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis would have even more
catastrophic effects as it would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper systems organization and their
war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that CIA/NSA/WTF... are
sponsoring these emoji flames to distract developers from the real job
which is to make private conversations user friendly and effortless.

Post by James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct forum for discussing the
recent change in emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced with the Apple emoji to
ensure consistency across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many Android users detest this
change and are actively looking for ways to revert it. Many users have
made their opinion public in the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite angry), etc. I haven't spoken to
any users who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but forcing Android users
into a design aesthetic contrary to the rest of their system is annoying.
Is there a way we can take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of users to
pick a better emoji set that can still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is neither Apple- nor Android-native.

- 359

--
Google Plus: https://plus.google.com/115459943980453987525
My PGP key is here
<http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x48CBE0180B9915EF>.
Help restore privacy and freedom of association for everyone by using
Signal <https://itunes.apple.com/app/id874139669> on iPhone and
TextSecure
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.securesms&hl=en>
and RedPhone
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.redphone&hl=en> on
Android.

[Raphael Arias]

Hi,

while I personally like the emoji one after having a longer look (my
first impression of the current frontpage was rather negative [0]), I
doubt that changing the emoji set again will be a more popular move than
changing them in the first place.

Me, personally, I don't care which set we use as all Android, Apple
(Whatsapp) and One seem ok to me. I could get behind an option to choose
them, although I don't know how much that would bloat the app (probably
not much) or the preferences (probably more -- contrary to
whispersystems design philosophy...).

I find it really interesting that the emoji change has caused so much
uproar (Whispersystems Tweet [1]).

I would not rush to a decision here, of changing things back to how they
were or doing some other rash thing. And I wonder it the other thread on
the mailing list a few days/weeks back is relevant here. Discuss
"meaningful" (apparently these changes are what *mean* most to a lot of
users, although I might not find them so relevant) changes like this or
the new colors (which I like but understand criticism about) on this
mailing list or similar platforms, before confronting users with those.

As always, thank you, all whispersystems developers and contributors! I
love you! ;)

So long and thanks for all the fish.

[0] http://emojione.com/
[1] https://twitter.com/whispersystems/status/622098158802243584

PS: yes, that's a text emoticon. That's how we used to write them!

Post by Omar B
So...
1) people on Android don't want apple's emojis
2) people on iOS don't want google's emojis
3) there are some emojis that are not translated quite well between
apple and google emojis
so..
4) we need a consistent experience, maybe with something neutral like
emoji one? If one likes apple emojis they will probably like emoji one
too (and will probably like them WAY better). Android users who complain
about apple's emojis will stop complaining, and Android users who
complain about google's emojis will stop complaining. The emojis will
look a bit nicer than they actually do, and I think it would be a
reasonable compromise to keep a consistent experience on different
platforms.
Hey everyone,
I’m following the mail list for a long time but never contributed to
it. But at this point I wanted to mention my opinion.
James was talking about user adoption driven by user experience.
Yes, I fully agree, but as the new emoji set is mainly the same as
on Whatsapp (from which I consider most people switch to TextSecure.
maybe just in my social environment), they don’t have a real change
in the emoji usage from now on. Before the update, a lot of
people were complaining about the different emoji set. Furthermore,
WA also shows the Android emojis in the notifications, as Kendra
mentioned. So again, no change when switching to TS.
Anyway, I will stay at TextSecure whatever emoji set is chosen. I
wanted to say thank you to the developers for the decision they made
as it will be easier for me to convince people of TextSecure. But,
what it more important, thank you for such a great app and the
always ongoing development!!
*Gesendet:* ‎Dienstag‎, ‎21‎. ‎Juli‎ ‎2015 ‎17‎:‎11
Hi Kendra and everyone,
Thanks for taking the time to write this. I second 100% what you have said.
A survey has been made (thank you for that) and opened to the users,
don't forget to participate.
Lastly, thanks all developers and contributors of TextSecure and
Open Whisper Systems for their superb products.
I also just joined this mailing list to express my distaste for
the change to Apple emoji. Folks who are complaining about how
this is unimportant or a CIA plot (really?), you might consider
how many folks have been willing to spend their time and energy
trying to express their discomfort with this change compared to
other changes and what that means about community engagement.
People care a lot about having a texting program that allows
them to communicate what they want, and sometimes what they want
is Android emojis.
Presumably someone had to actually switch the app to using Apple
emoji from Android, so someone thought this was important in the
first place. I know options come with costs, but I agree with
others that a toggle would be preferable. The current state
creates weird inconsistencies with the experience (I still see
Android emoji in my notifications, and my Swiftkey keyboard
still shows them until they show up in the TextSecure window).
Additionally, the Apple emoji that are being used seem to not
have all the same options as iOS (I can't seem to make the
"couple with heart" the same gender in TextSecure, which could
lead to some odd miscommunications), and I prefer the design on
the Android emoji. As someone who has been using the app
faithfully, this isn't a deal-breaker for me, but it does make
really really sad.
Anyway, thank you for a great product.
---
Kendra Albert
On Tue, Jul 21, 2015 at 7:36 AM, Corvin Russell
I fully agree with the below. I am sure there are good
reasons why this change was made, but even if there weren't,
it is far below other priorities for TextSecure.
2015-07-20 21:58 GMT-04:00 Shankar Kulumani
I'm still amazed that so much effort and heartache is
occurring over these emojis
These emoji are frankly distracting and using resources
that are better spent on more important issues. I
understand the reasons for TextSecure to support them
(everyone wants emojis and won't use TextSecure without
them)
I'm amazed at all the progress that is occurring on
TextSecure on a near continual basis but the emoji issue
is not important. The important issue is to make a
private messaging app that is easy and that everyone is
using.
On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 7:53 PM James Budarz
Why get an Android phone and then complain that it
doesn't look like iOS? The majority of Android
users prefer to have a consistent theme on their
phones, which is why TextSecure uses Material Design
and why there's been a huge backlash to this change.
If your best answer against changing it to something
better is that you don't want to irritate the
conspiracy theorists... I don't know what to say.
I'm just facepalming.
On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 9:33 PM #359
before the change to apple emojis there were
equal people on github ranting against the
android emojis in favour of apple's. so the
change back would only activate their anger again.
and the change to some third flavor of emojis
would have even more catastrophic effects as it
would unite apple emoji fanatics with android
emoji fanatics against the evil open whisper
systems organization and their war crimes.
if i was a conspiracy theories fan i'd say that
CIA/NSA/WTF... are sponsoring these emoji flames
to distract developers from the real job which
is to make private conversations user friendly
and effortless.
On July 21, 2015 2:28:09 AM CEST, James Budarz
I've been told that this is the correct
forum for discussing the recent change in
emoji in TextSecure for Android.
In update 2.22.2, the emoji set was replaced
with the Apple emoji to ensure consistency
across devices.
Generally speaking, it appears that many
Android users detest this change and are
actively looking for ways to revert it.
Many users have made their opinion public in
the Google Play Store, the GitHub issues
section (which makes the developers quite
angry), etc. I haven't spoken to any users
who like them.
I understand the need for consistency, but
forcing Android users into a design
aesthetic contrary to the rest of their
system is annoying. Is there a way we can
take a vote or otherwise gauge the desire of
users to pick a better emoji set that can
still be used across systems? Some had
suggested other open emoji set that is
neither Apple- nor Android-native.
- 359
--
Google Plus: https://plus.google.com/115459943980453987525
My PGP key is here
<http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x48CBE0180B9915EF>.
Help restore privacy and freedom of association for everyone
by using Signal
<https://itunes.apple.com/app/id874139669> on iPhone
and TextSecure
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.securesms&hl=en> and RedPhone
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.thoughtcrime.redphone&hl=en> on
Android.

[Adam Prescott]

Here's my main frustration with this change.

GitHub issues on this subject get closed without much explanation from the
maintainers / developers (who I admire for building an application with
such a good experience) about why this change was needed. People are
referred to this mailing list for discussion, because GitHub is for bug
tracking and bug reports. (Sometimes, as in
https://github.com/WhisperSystems/TextSecure-Browser/issues/235, even that
doesn't happen. TextSecure-Browser used to be under a completely different
GitHub account, and its README currently doesn't reference any mailing
list. But it's seems to nevertheless be part of the umbrella of official
projects.)

I haven't been able to find much discussion from the maintainers on the
reasons behind this change, which makes me think there could be more
communication in general. That might also help alleviate complaints.

Has anyone found anything in the list archives that they can point to?

I would hope that this mailing list doesn't exist just to give people an
isolated place to vent, if we're expected to have the discussion here and
not on GitHub.

[Eric Mill]

I'm glad this thread went in a more constructive and encouraging direction.
It's worth another message thanking the hell out of the TextSecure/Signal
team for making the most secure messaging app on the planet that is also
$0. I don't like Apple emoji on my Android phone, but I can live with it if
I have to.

I think the Whispersystems team may not be aware of how helpful it can be
for a major visual change to send out a brief heads up ahead of time of the
change and why it's being made, ahead of time, so at least there's a
rationale on record.

I think some members of the TextSecure/Signal community may not be aware of
how non-relevant they are to the success of the project at the stage of
adoption it's at. It's not surprising to me that Whispersystems finds it a
total waste of time to deal with negative energy from this community, even
if that negative energy has some justification behind it. Positive energy
is going to go a lot further in making change -- and is really the only
effective way to be heard right now.

-- Eric

Post by Adam Prescott
Here's my main frustration with this change.
GitHub issues on this subject get closed without much explanation from the
maintainers / developers (who I admire for building an application with
such a good experience) about why this change was needed. People are
referred to this mailing list for discussion, because GitHub is for bug
tracking and bug reports. (Sometimes, as in
https://github.com/WhisperSystems/TextSecure-Browser/issues/235, even
that doesn't happen. TextSecure-Browser used to be under a completely
different GitHub account, and its README currently doesn't reference any
mailing list. But it's seems to nevertheless be part of the umbrella of
official projects.)
I haven't been able to find much discussion from the maintainers on the
reasons behind this change, which makes me think there could be more
communication in general. That might also help alleviate complaints.
Has anyone found anything in the list archives that they can point to?
I would hope that this mailing list doesn't exist just to give people an
isolated place to vent, if we're expected to have the discussion here and
not on GitHub.

[Cl En]

Totally agree

Eric Mill <***@konklone.com> schrieb am Mi., 22. Juli 2015 06:35:



I think the Whispersystems team may not be aware of how helpful it can be
for a major visual change to send out a brief heads up ahead of time of the
change and why it's being made, ahead of time, so at least there's a
rationale

on the record.

[Federico NK-X-TODEL918a]

I think that consistency between devices is a big deal, unfortunately I
do not think that this is the way to achieve this.

TS can handle push message and sms.
We can reach consistency between TS to TS message in this way, but we
can't do this for sms to another client.
I use push message only with 2 friends, and sms with all the remaining.
Now i can see the same emojis of my girlfriend (she has an iPhone 4 so
she can't install Signal), but i can't see the same emojis of my friend
(with android).

I see 3 solutions:

1. Fuck that shit, after all consistency isn't a big deal, let's use
native emojis.
2. We search consistency only between push message.
1. Use Apple's emojis, rage from Android user (how many TS user?).
2. Use Android's emojis, rage from Apple user (how many Signal user?).
3. The "anti-development ideology way".

The first point of development ideology
(https://github.com/WhisperSystems/TextSecure/blob/master/contributing.md)
say
"The answer is not more options. If you feel compelled to add a
preference that's exposed to the user, it's very possible you've made a
wrong turn somewhere."
so this is only a speculation, but as we can choose the color of a
conversation, we may choose the emoji's set of the conversation, in this
way we can have consistency with push and sms message, with TS user or not.

I think sometime have the freedom to choose is not wrong, and if i don't
wont to choose i take up the default option.

"Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler" Albert Einstein(?)

[Bryan]

Emoji options isn't that big of a deal. When you weigh privacy/security against cute little faces smiling... Which is more important?

This little flame war between android emoji and apple emoji is a waste of time. You'll never make everyone happy unless you have a labyrinth of options to choose from.

Again, thanks to the devs that work hard on TS and improve the privacy/security of the rest of us.

--Bryan

On July 22, 2015 8:10:35 PM CDT, Federico Lazzari <***@hotmail.it> wrote:
| I think that consistency between devices is a big deal, unfortunately
| I
| do not think that this is the way to achieve this.
|
| TS can handle push message and sms.
| We can reach consistency between TS to TS message in this way, but we
| can't do this for sms to another client.
| I use push message only with 2 friends, and sms with all the
| remaining.
| Now i can see the same emojis of my girlfriend (she has an iPhone 4 so
|
| she can't install Signal), but i can't see the same emojis of my
| friend
| (with android).
|
| I see 3 solutions:
|
| 1. Fuck that shit, after all consistency isn't a big deal, let's use
| native emojis.
| 2. We search consistency only between push message.
| 1. Use Apple's emojis, rage from Android user (how many TS user?).
| 2. Use Android's emojis, rage from Apple user (how many Signal user?).
| 3. The "anti-development ideology way".
|
| The first point of development ideology
| (https://github.com/WhisperSystems/TextSecure/blob/master/contributing.md)
|
| say
| "The answer is not more options. If you feel compelled to add a
| preference that's exposed to the user, it's very possible you've made
| a
| wrong turn somewhere."
| so this is only a speculation, but as we can choose the color of a
| conversation, we may choose the emoji's set of the conversation, in
| this
| way we can have consistency with push and sms message, with TS user or
| not.
|
| I think sometime have the freedom to choose is not wrong, and if i
| don't
| wont to choose i take up the default option.
|
| "Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler" Albert
| Einstein(?)

[Leandro Salvador]

WhatsApp and Telegram, that I know, both of them use Apple emoji over
iPhone and over Android, isn't it? I think the deal shouldn't be Android
vs. Apple emojis, but if TextSecure will follow the market leaders, or
don't. I think 98% of emojis' experience lived by humanity happens over
WhatsApp, not over operational systems (Android, Apple) purely. So it's
because I think it's a nice shot TS uses the same emoji concepts used by
WA. It's versus WhatsApp and Telegram the TextSecure "market share", so the
Android versus Apple deal maybe be irrelevant. My 2 cents.

(Enviado via Linux Android.)

[Samuel Merritt]

Post by Bryan
Emoji options isn't that big of a deal. When you weigh privacy/security
against cute little faces smiling... Which is more important?

Turns out it's the little faces, at least for some users.

I'll give a real example: my mother-in-law. She started using TextSecure
because I suggested it. I explained about how it keeps messages hidden
from everyone, even Verizon and Google, and she agreed that it was worth
a try.

After the emoji change, she went back to Hangouts because TextSecure was
"ugly" and "doesn't look like [her] other apps".

I got the update and, while I noticed the new emoji, it didn't really
matter to me. However, I told my wife about it, and she looked at my
phone, went to her phone, and promptly disabled updates for TextSecure.

If the "cute little faces" are making some users switch to other
messaging apps, then perhaps they *are* a big deal.

[James Budarz]

The app is only as secure as the number of people you can get to use it.

Post by Samuel Merritt

Post by Bryan
Emoji options isn't that big of a deal. When you weigh privacy/security
against cute little faces smiling... Which is more important?

Turns out it's the little faces, at least for some users.
I'll give a real example: my mother-in-law. She started using TextSecure
because I suggested it. I explained about how it keeps messages hidden
from everyone, even Verizon and Google, and she agreed that it was worth
a try.
After the emoji change, she went back to Hangouts because TextSecure was
"ugly" and "doesn't look like [her] other apps".
I got the update and, while I noticed the new emoji, it didn't really
matter to me. However, I told my wife about it, and she looked at my
phone, went to her phone, and promptly disabled updates for TextSecure.
If the "cute little faces" are making some users switch to other
messaging apps, then perhaps they *are* a big deal.